Get Out of Your Own Way and Step into Your Power, with Amber Hurdle, CEO of Employer Brand Central

Alex: 0:38

Welcome to Alex and Annie, the real women of vacation rentals. I'm Alex and I'm Annie and I'm Amber. Yay, yay, hey, amber, back again, back again. We've got Amber Hurdle.

Amber Hurdle: 0:50

The triple A's are back.

Alex: 0:51

Yeah, the triple A's and actually we all have the same initials. So we have Hurdle on on the show, who is the CEO and founder of Employer Brand Central. Amber was episode two of our podcast. We're on episode 127, I believe, or no, 129. 129. 127 episodes ago, two years ago, almost to the day, we had you on the show, amber. It is amazing to see you and welcome back.

Amber Hurdle: 1:20

Thanks. I always love hanging out with two of my favorite bombshells.

Annie: 1:24

I just can't. Even we talked off camera and I think it's just it's just so apropos that we're getting ready for the women's conference that it was two years ago that we kind of really, really bonded and met and you have been so integral to me and Alex's I don't say our awakening, our revolution, our blossoming, whatever you want to call it. You've just been such an important part of it, not only as a guidepost, but someone who's been a friend and a confidant and just a really great human being to get to know, and we're very honored and blessed to have you in our world.

Amber Hurdle: 1:54

Well, back at you. I mean, I think back to that and it was like, okay, who are these ladies? And, yeah, I'll be on your show and you're going to be great at podcasting and your personalities are great. And then to have, like, such a beautiful friendship unfold from all of that and you know, really, you know I have appreciated you all because I was in such a transitionary part of my life and really clearing out a lot of relationships that no longer belonged in my life, that were not good, and then ushering in beautiful humans like you that were like didn't backfill anything, like you just filled up a space and such a pure and loving and non-judgmental way and there was no expectations except for me to be who I am and that like now, those are only relationships I have. I thought I was pretty cold at the time, but then you're like oh no, there's more, there's more to clean it. This is the way I put it. You know, when you clean out your closet and you're like I'm not wearing that anymore, I'm not wearing that anymore and you're like okay, and then you go in there like for another round because you're like I'm still not wearing that, like that needs to go to like I thought I cleaned out my closet and that's like perfect and you can actually see what you have and when you buy something new you're not like cramming it in it's breathing space and it's all things that you love. That is my friendship closet. Now it's great and I love the color in it.

Annie: 3:16

Well, I'm really grateful to be in your closet.

Alex: 3:21

We've come out of the closet with Amber. We were very grateful for you and anybody who's listened to the show since the beginning of time. In episode two we actually we had to record our episode with Amber, I think three or four times, because there's always problems. There was always problems and this was the. That was the first time we had recorded with somebody else. The episode one, the aha moment, was just Annie and I and we always we tell the story all the time that if it had been anybody else that we had for episode two, we probably wouldn't have continued with doing the podcast because nobody else would have ever been as accepting yeah, patient, of how awful that was. But you were there the whole way and said you guys can do this and I believe in you and that's meant a lot to us and we've we've stumbled and we've we've learned a lot in the last couple of years. But I do think you know, looking back two years ago, my gosh, our lives have changed so much since then. All three of us really I mean I was we had just started the show, I was still at condo world, my mentor, roy, had just passed, annie was was still with lexicon and we had a year ahead of us that we did not have any idea what's about to hit us and what a year it was. And then this year too, it's. Every year has been just a different chapter, but it's good to have those inflection points and heading into the women's conference and just another. Well, actually, by the time that this episode, we will all be at the women's conference, which is even better. But heading into that, we're so excited to see you and hear what you're going to be delivering to that audience. So I guess, to kick it off, can you share a little bit of what you're going to be doing in the future and what your involvement in Amy high notes event will be? Yeah, so I'm doing my favorite. I'm kicking off the conference. I'm the opening keynote.

Amber Hurdle: 5:05

Get that energy up, like let's all mentally get to where we need to be, and hopefully that will carry through the rest of the conference and it's just my favorite slot to be. My keynote is unlocking your potential, how to get out of your own way, and I'm excited to be part of that, and I'm excited to be part of that. But how can you lock in your potential, how to get out of your own way, which both of y'all are great examples of that, because you grew and you expanded and you have completely different realities now because you chose to get out of your own way. And you know we were talking recording together and it's worthy of a mention for all the listeners to get in on. Two, and it's like social media the other day about my move and I said I'm unstoppable, and somebody was like wow, like just so cool, you can say that out loud to people and like not be ashamed. And I'm like well, it's not, like I get a bozo button for it. I'm unstoppable, I haven't stopped yet. You just have to keep getting back up and keep going. And so obviously there's a lot more to it than that, but I'm just going to walk everyone through, like if you can do these things, then there's no code or key that somebody's going to hand you. You have to figure out how to unlock your own potential, because nobody knows what you're capable of other than you truly. And people can see your potential. I know that's one of my greatest gifts is seeing somebody else's potential and helping them see it for themselves. And those are important relationships, to have those mirror relationships. But I can't con somebody into stepping into their greatness. I can't tell somebody no, you're totally capable of doing that, and I think you can also do X, y and Z if they're unwilling to receive it or see it or find it in themselves. So don't want to give away too much. But if you leave the women's summit and you don't have a big breeze and wind in your sail when you leave, what you might be actually capable of, then I haven't done my job.

Annie: 7:04

Yeah, no, true. And I think the great thing about you, amber, too, is that for me it was just like having not only the confidence but having the ability to identify those people that I needed to have kind of with me along the way. And that was a really, really hard thing. I had not nurtured those relationships because I just didn't know where I fit in for such a long time. And I was able to. I think we were doing a seminar one of the session recently and I popped on and just my comment was like I walked away from all that and I found my voice. I just I found I could say things and I didn't have to second guess myself like who's going to like it or who's not going to like it, because not everybody's going to like it and not everybody's going to hate it. There's going to be people that are in between. But it was just recognizing that you just have to say the words and say the things and you'll attract the right people and the right circumstances and just have that and it's. I don't think it's a confidence, it's a comfort that it will all work out the way it's supposed to work out, but you just have to be willing to be receptive to the doors that open or the windows that closes. Whatever you know, you want to metaphor you want to use to look at it.

Amber Hurdle: 8:08

Yeah, and I think you know that's my breakout sessions. So I'm doing a two part breakout session, so the first half it's all about personal branding. But like personal branding gosh the three of us have had conversations around that on the air and off the air but it's like positioning your value in the workplace and it's applicable to people who own their own businesses as well. But you know, you said it, annie you said you know the right opportunities and the right circumstances, and when I talk about personal branding, I literally say so you can attract the right people and opportunities to your life, and that's what this is all about. Like, part of unlocking your potential is just telling the world hey, this is who I am and this is what I'm about, so bring me the things that help me be me. And and so when you're working on your personal branding, you're trying to surround yourself with the right people who are going to celebrate your contributions to the world. And I know that sounds so big, but even just your podcast, like you are contributing to the world by way of niching to a particular industry. People love listening to you. They have aha moments that you serve to them on a literally, you call them aha moments to serve them on a silver platter but then helps them be better in their companies, with their families, like whatever that looks like. The industry grows as a whole because you've chosen to say, hey, we're pretty good at this and we've got some things to share, and so I'm going to raise my hand and I'm going to get out of my own way and put myself out there and position myself and just trust God. Some people say trust the universe, but my personal self talk when Gertrude's not here doing this is. You know, I'm going to say it from a, from a place of faith, and I don't need anybody listening to believe what I believe. You stick to your wisdom tradition or your nothing tradition if you're, you know, atheist or whatever. So for me, if I am walking in God's will, I'm trying to walk in God's will. Even if I screw up, he's going to honor that, he's going to put me right back on track. And if that's not your thing, and if you want to believe that the universe is conspiring in your favor, it's the same thing, like whatever's going on in your vortex if you get off course, because you're genuinely trying to stay in your vortex and you're generally trying to stay on the path that's meant for your life and you make a mistake, the vortex is going to suck you back in. You can't screw it up and we never get there. So, like, just keep going right. And that's what the three times that we recorded that episode was really about.

Alex: 10:32

Yeah, and I think it's. I mean, it's about recognizing the signs. It's about knowing, like you said, that whether it's the universe or God or whatever it is that you believe in spiritually, it's recognizing the signs that if you go off path, it's actually like it was supposed to happen, like things, you're being protected, you're being promoted, there's a reason why you had to see something, because it made you go in a different direction, that now you're going to be in a better position for something else. And I think when you look at things that way, it makes it easier to understand and just know like it's in God's hands, it's in the universe's hands, like I'm going to go with this and you really do what you can do. Yeah, yeah, exactly Exactly. We had Stacey St John on the podcast last Wednesday and talk about another female powerhouse, but she talked a lot about. You know, to be a mentor to somebody. It doesn't mean that you have to have all the answers, like you just have to be one step ahead of where they are. And that you mentioned about us in the podcast and how people have had all these aha moments, and we get that all the time, and to me it's always when we go to conferences and people share wow, they listen to the show, how they listen to the show. It's touching and it's surprising because it's like we don't feel like we're sharing crazy wisdom here, but it doesn't. It's about making connections with people. It's about connecting the dots and you never know how you're impacting somebody else's life just by the information that you're sharing. That you might not think it's groundbreaking, but to somebody that meant the world. And I remember actually on episode two, you said when you take the stage, that your goal you just want to help one person in the audience. If you connect with one person, then your job is done and hopefully you connect with a bunch more. But if you help that one person, you have changed somebody's life. And I know I've been that one person in an audience for somebody on stage or somebody that I've listened to on a podcast or a book. And I know I think about those people that I look to, as they're not mentors, necessarily. They could be celebrities or celebrity authors or podcasters, but I still look at them because of the content they've shared. That has changed my life and you're doing that on a daily basis in your role, which has got to be super fulfilling.

Amber Hurdle: 12:47

You know, especially in our industry. You know, I say it's kind of weird because I say our industry, because I do work so much in our industry. It's mine too Like.

Alex: 12:58

I'm not a vacation.

Amber Hurdle: 12:58

You're like a fairy godmother of vacation rentals. He just kind of flew in and landed and like got the pixie dust over all of this I work in other industries and I love those industries too, but I kind of like come in and I out and I have clients and like whatever. But I'm not like like you guys are in my world every single day, all the time, like my friends, like you know, it's just, it's really. It's such a more embedded, I guess you would say, and my spirit, and so with that I'm also sort of a repository of trust because of what I do for a living and so, yes, I've had coaching clients that actually pay me and then I also have I just receive a lot of information about this industry and a lot of when things are changing or shifting or whatever. I usually have that information before other people realize what's happening. And so, as I reflect on the past two years and I think about the shifts that have happened in so many women's lives from the last women's summit to this women's summit, and there's a term that I've used a lot in my on the coaching side of my world and that's like, you know, somebody's freaking out over what's happening in their life or their career at the time and I'm like, oh yeah, you're on a bridge. You're just on a bridge and like and I'm talking a lot about it because it's like, oh, there's a temporary, like you see where you're going, it's over there, like you're not there yet, but like you have a bridge, you're on it. And so, just like, except that you're on a bridge, there's no troll underneath you that's going to like take you on or anything, just you're on a bridge. And so this means this is a transitionary season where you're needing to learn lessons, where you're needing to grow in certain areas and and this is the season where you are inviting new people into your life, you are connecting with different experiences so that when you get to the other side of this bridge, you're ready for that terrain, because where you just came from and what you've been doing is not at all what's going to get you to where you're going. And so sometimes we have to be in those in between seasons to realize what's real, to realize what you're capable of, to realize what you're not going to put up with anymore, to put new parameters and new environments around you to support you for this next season. And so, as we're moving into this new season of women's summit, I'm just really stoked to hug a lot of necks of people who are on the other side of their bridge and I'm just like you know how I do I get tears behind my eyes. I'm not upset or anything, but that's true when that happens to me. That's truth and there's just. You guys have done it. I won't give anything away. But, like there's so many women that if we think about where they were two years ago, their lives were completely different and that's cool. And it takes building a strong personal brand and it takes getting out of your way.

Alex: 15:48

And you don't know, you can't connect the dots until you're further ahead to look back and connect them. You know that's obviously a very a common thread of this podcast and a message that we've shared a lot, because it is so true for Annie and I and so many of our listeners and just being able to see that constantly come in, come to play, is great and interesting. But definitely I feel like there's a lot of people that are on that bridge and I wanted to. I went back, I listened to episode two before we recorded today and I have a different perspective on all of it now, two years later. But one thing that you talked about that was really interesting to me was you talked about the time in your life when you were at Gaylord hospitality there in our gay hotels, I'm sorry in Nashville, and you had built up this incredible career there and when things were going to change you realized like there was never going to be another Gaylord and you had to look introspectively at what you like to do, what you were good at, what your mission was, and then you went out and created your new version of what a career looked like on your own and I just I think it would be helpful for you to tell our audience a little bit about that experience, because there's a lot to it and I think your process there was really inspiring.

Amber Hurdle: 17:02

Yeah. So when I thought about where else in Nashville could I work that would have that kind of a culture, that kind of a leadership team I mean our we call them LLC the leadership committee is all the VPs and the senior vice president and rock stars I mean just the greatest leadership team ever. And then, like the fun that I got to have and the money I got to spend and the experience that I got to create, like who was going to give me that opportunity? And they're just at the time, 11 plus years ago, there wasn't another organization in the Nashville that like did things at that level. And so I was like, okay, so then what is it that I'm good at? So I have the event production background and obviously the communications and engagement and that sort of thing. But when I really thought about, what is it that I'm best at here, and then other jobs it wasn't even the core part of my job. It was like this thing that I did that senior leaders were like, oh, we need her to do this and I would literally be signed like assigned to people that they didn't know that I was assigned to them and it was helping leaders with their personal brands. I mean, the employer brand was my job, that was my job. But the personal brand part like none of the employer branding stuff would work if there were more personal brands that were trusted and beloved, leading the employer branding efforts. And so that's where I started connecting the dots, because we believed you know the service profit chain and this is a little bit long, but there's this is a background that we need to understand. Where I got to where I am. The service profit chain, which is a Harvard business model, says that if you take care of your employees, they're going to take care of your customers, and then your customers will be loyal and then you make money and that's you know. I kind of took my own spin on that and I'm like okay, so we have to have personal, really strong personal brands who are leading a strong employer brand. And if you have a strong employer brand, well, you can attract and keep the best. And so guess what's going to happen for your customers? They're going to have a great experience because you have rock stars on your team who actually care about them, and so you have to have all three of those things. And what I realized was okay, so I should become a coach. So I went and got ICF certified and I got all my hours and all that kind of stuff. It was just knowing the next step of what really made me feel great, where I can see very clearly the impact that I was making. Because, let's be real, if we're going to spend the majority of our time working, shouldn't it be something that is edifying to us? Shouldn't it be something where you feel like you're contributing to something bigger than yourself? And so that meant, okay, I need to help more. I thought I was going to be. I was going to be a corporate executive coach and I was just. That was what I was going to do.

Speaker 1: 19:41

And then I'm like that's not what happened.

Amber Hurdle: 19:43

And so just that one step led me to the next step. And then it was like, hey, can you put together a training program for this company? And I'm like, okay, yeah, sure. And then it was like, can you help with this business and teach me how to market? It was like, okay, sure, hey, you're really good with training. Can you stand on stage and talk for 50 minutes at a big conference? Memorize? Yeah, like, just stand up all day and teach things. But like, okay, and then, and then, and then, and then, and so now fast forward, 11 years later, and you know we did launch employer brand central. And here's the funny thing is basically what I did at Gaylord, but designed in a way that small to mid-sized businesses can have the same kind of employer brand that a big business has, that they can go out and they can systematize and hand over toolkits to their leaders at an affordable price so that they can attract talent, onboard them correctly, engage them and then keep them and have a good experience when they off board, so that they're talking kindly about you to other people, which is going to impact your business brand. And we could get way into the weeds on how and why this is so important. But the crazy thing is is here I am full circle doing what I got paid to do for a corporate company and on top of it, the person who did my job at corporate for Gaylord what Ryman Hospitality or Gaylord Hotels at the time. They've changed so many times. Now they have opera entertainment group and she now is my COO and my success coach is yes, yeah, Brandy.

Speaker 1: 21:14

Forbes.

Amber Hurdle: 21:16

And yes, I have a Vanderbilt MBA COO we were doing a big time and of course I have a whole team and they're all great, but then, like Pam, san Diego is our success coach, so she walks alongside the HR, the ABC champion, the employer brand central champion to make sure that they're successful at implementing these things, because I know we're all running around like a chicken with her head cut off at all times. You need somebody to help guide you and be accountable and answer questions and block and tackle with you, and she was the general manager at the Inn at Opryland, which was, you know, we lovingly referred to as the overflow hotel for Opryland. And you know this past life of mine I'm working with some of the same people, only I own the business now. Isn't it funny that we're all women who left corporate America to be seen and heard and valued and allow our voices to actually have an impact?

Annie: 22:09

Yeah, I'd like to say it's ironic, but it's not. What a great testament to getting the right people in your closet, lining them up for a future, for a future. I think that you definitely don't know where people are going to have the most impact in your life when you meet them. If you keep nurturing those relationships, it's interesting to see how they come in and out. We talk about Lauren Madewell. She's someone that again met first and actually did not meet her, but saw her on stage at the First Women's Conference I went to, which is the one in New Orleans that we talk about, and ended up connecting with her through LinkedIn. She's literally one of my most absolutely favorite sister from another Mr People I've ever met in my life. I met her in person finally last year at Vermont Vegas. I saw her and it ran up to her and gave her the biggest hug. She was a lot like again a sister I hadn't seen in 10 years, but she's been so important in my world just for feedback and just back and forth support and conversation and all of these relationships that you just don't understand how impactful they are until again. Like Alex always says on the show, you can't connect the dots and she can look back. I got asked to be on a panel for the Women's Conference to talk about my career path and how I did what I did. I was like I wouldn't have had any idea at the beginning where I was going to go. But would I do it all over again? 100% I would make all the same mistakes, maybe tweak a few of them, maybe not to be quite so bad. But everything, just everything, and every person that's been in my world that mattered, that I needed to have in my life. Today they're still here. It is so important about your brand and your relationships and all of that nurturing that goes on.

Amber Hurdle: 23:50

I mean, I think about my team, which group doubled this year, and so my director of training is a former student customer. Our operations manager is a former student coaching customer. Both of those women attended my women's retreat that I did in 2021. Women that's in my world was already in my world, with the exception of my executive assistant, who's a total baddie and it's hysterical how she even got hired, but she's so persistent that I was like man, if you're that persistent to get the job, you will keep me in check, and boy has she. So she's the only person who was unknown to me. It was just really easy to be like you're a good fit for this and talk about like the universe, God or whatever it's, like the changes that were happening in their lives were aligning with my needs, and like you just don't know, and you know even. Talk about Lauren Madewell, and I'm kind of laughing because the first time I met her was because she was in the audience at the women's summit and then she ended up doing Velvet Machete Leadership Academy and now it would probably be low balling that we text every other day. You know what I mean. Like I usually borns in my week every week. If it's not an everyday thing, it's usually every couple of days and if it's been longer than that and it's like where are you?

Annie: 25:03

Absolutely, you just feel her energy is missing.

Amber Hurdle: 25:07

Yeah, and it's really a beat that drum so hard of your people environment. So we talked about networking. I'm one of the pre. You know the webinars that we did leading up to the women's summit, because it's just that important when you, when you're your friend closet that we're going to coin that now. Annie and Alex, we have friend closet.

Alex: 25:23

Friend closet yeah.

Amber Hurdle: 25:24

Friend closet. I need you in my friend closet. I got to get rid of someone over here first to make room for you. But when you do have that room to fill your friend closet full of just things that you love, I mean, how many dresses do y'all have hanging in your closets that you don't wear every day? But when that occasion comes, you're like I know exactly what I'm going to wear. Yeah, that's true. And it hangs in my closet and I might bring it out only twice a year. Yeah, I think that's how relationships are. As you, you nurture and you maintain these relationships and you know my gay lord family is very I'm super close with them still to this day, all these years later, and like when that opportunity comes, like Brandy, I thought she was going to be a consultant with us and then she, we got into some. She's like I just need to be your COO and I was like I'm sorry, I didn't realize that was an option. Sign me up. Yes, let's do this Like I didn't know and so just being intentional and that's, it's your brand. You don't get those relationships to if people don't know what to expect of you, if they don't know the value that you bring, if they don't understand that they can trust you and that you are a fit, that you share values with them. And so it's safe to open up to you and allow you in, so that you're either that person that you text messages every day or twice a year you reach out to. You know they're going to be there. You know what I mean.

Alex: 26:38

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Amber Hurdle: 27:57

Yeah, you know Cheryl's keynote that she's going to do like how to live a brave enough life. I can't wait to hear that and I can't wait to meet her and experience that keynote. Because brave enough, right that? I love that. That's the title, because it's not about just being inherently confident all times, and some of us have a little more of that than others. Like a little more like I'm just okay with myself, and if you don't like me, there's billions of people in the world who are going to find you one that you like. It doesn't have to be me, you know, right, but not everybody has that. But what we all can have is just to believe in ourselves enough to know that when I walk into this room, like can I pick on you, annie, real quick? I remember we were having dinner at the Roosevelt Hotel in New Orleans and you were uncertain about like how you even package yourself up. You know, when we're talking about personal branding, not that you were like shopping yourself or anything, but like you were like well, I've, you know, I've done this and I've done that and I've done this, and it's just kind of all over the place and everybody's like really good at one thing and I was like, yeah, that's your value. You know all the things. Like you have the all income thing. Like look at all the experience. You have this holistic way of approaching this industry that not everybody else has. They have to go, get that information, they have to lean on other people and you just have it all in your head Like that is your value and so you know. It's about knowing your value and positioning your value and being okay with failing and not expecting to have this surge of confidence at all times. I understand I'm a confident woman and I understand that I'm perceived as a confident woman. But if y'all don't think that I haven't cried into my pillow just like everybody else listening to this, or that you know my boyfriend doesn't have to pump me up, or my friends don't have to pump me up sometimes, or my own team has to be like good Lord, amber, nobody's harder on you than you. Like geez, you know. I mean like None of us are invaluable. We're just brave enough, we're just confident enough to get through this next thing. And if we screw it all up, to be confident enough to say, well, I'm going to learn a lesson and do it better next time, just dust yourself off and give it another go. That's the way you get through life. That's the way you get. What you want is by just worry. Just keep swimming, yeah.

Alex: 30:22

I think one thing that I've learned is you have to remember too that everybody feels vulnerable, uncomfortable, not good enough at some point in the day, like every single person on this planet. So a lot of people think that just because you might seem confident, that you are confident but that doesn't mean that I mean the most confident looking people in the world could have insecurities that you don't know about. And to Annie Annie always says this you never know what somebody's dealing with, and Annie is just the kindest, most sweetest person in the world that she just wants to be nice to everybody, just in case anybody's having a bad day that day, which I absolutely love. But I think it's just important to recognize that not everybody has it figured out.

Speaker 1: 31:05

And we all feel like, internally, like oh, is it just me?

Alex: 31:09

It's not. Nobody has this whole thing of life figured out. But the confidence is not static. It is something that you constantly have to be working on. It's like if you go to the gym every day for a year but then you don't go for two years, you're not still going to have muscles. I mean, you have to continuously work on it. How bad is that stuck on your back?

Amber Hurdle: 31:27

Yeah, exactly Like being able to. Why is that?

Alex: 31:30

Yeah, yeah, and that's why just with going to the being healthy or working on your confidence. It is something that you should always be cognizant of because, yeah, it gets a lot harder to build back once you haven't, and if you're in a situation where your confidence is constantly being torn down, it's going to be a lot harder to build it back up if you continue to go down that route.

Amber Hurdle: 31:55

But it's because of the people and opportunities in your life that knock you down, and so that's why I'm such a hard A about who are you surrounding yourself with? What opportunities are you putting? Are you raising your hand and just going for it, like that is? Your constant exercising of confidence is constantly putting yourself in positions that will show you what you're capable of. If you're sitting in the dugout and you won't ever get to the plate, you're not going to know if you can hit a dong or not. You don't know if you're a first base hitter, a bunter, or if you could hit a home run. If you're hanging out in the dugout the whole time, get out of the dugout, get in the batter's box, keep having your at bats, keep swinging, like that's what you have to do, but you also have to do it strategically, and so there's low risk situations you could put yourself in, and when I'm coaching and somebody has struggles communicating or being assertive or things like that, I honestly tell them go to the deli, just go to the deli at the grocery store, and I want you to say this, or ask for this, or expect this from the person who is cutting your meat or your cheese or whatever it is that you want to get. And they're like what? And I'm like is there any risk? If the deli man doesn't like you, I don't care. If the deli man doesn't like me, great, let's practice the deli man we're not putting him on the spot or making him feel awkward but especially with assertiveness. No, actually I would like that cut a little bit thinner. They want to make you happy.

Alex: 33:24

They want to make you happy, exactly.

Annie: 33:25

Ask for it.

Alex: 33:27

Ask for what you want.

Amber Hurdle: 33:28

But ask for what you want, at least with the deli guy, and then try it at work.

Annie: 33:31

I remember you saying to me we were talking about confidence and I was talking about and Alex and I recount this all the time our first meeting with each other and how we both saw each other in very different lights. And when we talked about it, I was like, well, I was so intimidated by her and she's like, and you looked right at me and you go, that's on you, that is totally on you, because Alex wasn't trying to intimidate me. Right, but it was the first time somebody said that to me in a way that it was like it made sense. It wasn't like, well, you shouldn't. People normally will say, well, don't be intimidated, or you shouldn't be intimidated, and you just put it very simply just, that's your percent, that's on you. You have to get past that, and so, from that moment on, I started looking at relationships and looking at people that had either intimidated me, made me feel less than made me feel like I didn't belong, helped build my imposter syndrome, whatever it could be. I looked at them in different light. I was like I deserve to be here damn it, you know.

Speaker 1: 34:24

Like it's a great way. I deserve it.

Annie: 34:27

I mean, and going back to what Alex said, I've told people I know I'm never going to be the PhD smartest person in the room, but if I can be, you know, but there are things I know a lot about. Generally, I try to be around smarter people than me because I learn more. I mean, I think that that's a principle that I've always had. But I always want to be nice, I always want to be kind and you know, I feel very centered around the fact that I have a hospitality gene in me and it's not going anywhere and if I can share that light with people, like that's what I want to do. But I also I don't want to allow that tendency to be nice to come across as being too soft and not being able to stand up for myself and being intimidated, you know, or you know being intimidated by other people, allowing that to happen to me.

Alex: 35:12

What a great lesson we both learned, though, in that situation of, like you know, that was such a groundbreaking moment and conference for both of us that that's when we met. We met, or I met, several people at that conference that have changed the course of my career. At one point they did at least, and you know I went into that. You thought that I seemed very confident Inside. I was very self-conscious because I didn't know anybody there, but I didn't. You know it's always awkward going into a room when you're not sure about anybody, but I was immediately drawn to you because you put off this vibe of just you were happy and you were nice and you were friendly and you wanted to support me and I thought, gosh, like she's just so nice. But and you look back on things and I don't know if it was Amber that brought this out in us, but I definitely I look at things differently now, too that when people, whether it's at work or in your day-to-day life, wherever it is, if they are not acting the way that you would prefer them to act, you have to think about it, of like what's going on in their life. Right, it's not about you how somebody is reacting, and I think about, even when I react certain ways that, like I have to check myself of, like I shouldn't, I'm letting my own issues of that day, whatever the problem is now reflect out onto other people, and I don't like that, right. So I think we're all in this constant like cycle of trying to be more reflective, more self-aware, and it's a good thing, right? I mean, I think a few years ago people weren't really worried about being self-aware, but it's obviously a big part of our culture now and just our world and for us. I know you have helped us with that quite a bit.

Annie: 36:53

What a gift, though, for us to be able to have that conversation, because how many people have we met along the way that we've never been able to go like? How did you perceive me? How did I perceive you?

Alex: 37:02

Let's get to the root of it.

Annie: 37:03

Like.

Speaker 1: 37:04

I mean.

Annie: 37:04

I think about that all the time. I think there's people in my life that I would like gosh. I wish I could go back and get inside their head and understand like what was it? That was the radiating, whatever that vibe was that I was taking?

Alex: 37:15

Well, Amber, you talked about the importance of those mirror relationships, right. Like that's what that was for us.

Amber Hurdle: 37:22

Yes, and you two were brought together for a wonderful, beautiful purpose and I also remember like I remember kind of trying to tiptoe it, but like not speak it over you, but also kind of prepare you, because I'm like you two are two physically beautiful women who are intelligent and talented and accomplished, and if you don't think people are coming after you at some point, like it's gonna happen, and again it's a reflection of them, what's happening in their lives, in their worlds or whatever, and y'all are like no we haven't had any problems yet. Am I right?

Alex: 37:56

Yeah, I remember this conversation when it comes to standing in your power place.

Amber Hurdle: 37:59

Remember who you are, remember it's about them has nothing to do with you. You didn't ask for it, you didn't earn it. There's nothing wrong with you. Nose isn't crooked like keep truckin', just keep steppin'. And you know and I think that's the other thing that shakes our confidence is when you have a need for external validation, then other people's opinion of you or how they treat you or mistreat you is something that you internalize because you're dependent on their affirmation for your own personal value. When you do have a strong personal brand, which only can come because you're self-aware and because you know your value and because you're gonna stand in your power, that kind of stuff just I mean it's annoying, don't get me wrong, but it doesn't get to you, it doesn't mess up your psyche or keep you from your goals, because like that's their problem. I'm movin' on Right rolls off your shoulder. Yeah, it has to, because otherwise you're letting somebody else have your power, you're giving your power away. And when you give your power away, how can you ever be confident? And I love, I've just loved watching you, too, standing your power for two years of publishing 129 episodes. I mean that's impressive, with a big spotlight on you and lots of people watching you. In an industry that is a smaller, you know I mean it's a huge industry there's so many people who would have no clue who. All three of us are Right, but, like you know, the active part of the industry that that crowd is, you know it's it's a small family and it's it's hard to put yourself out there. And there's a lot of women in the past couple of years who have transitioned into their own businesses and have had to come out from behind the logo that they're hiding behind and put themselves out there. And I'm just happy to always point to you two, as I'm pointing on wherever you are on my screen, who knows what this is going to look like. I like to point to you two and like, well, they did it. Look at them. They put themselves out there and you think they're doing OK, why can't you?

Alex: 39:54

One thing that you said earlier that I think is worth touching on a little bit more to is with the employer brand and the personal brands of your, of your, employees. There are a lot of employers that that makes them very uneasy to think that their employees are building their own personal brands or that they're going to, you know, be speaking on behalf of the company, and I know I mean public companies. I know there's a lot of rules and things, but in your experience, how do you coach companies on understanding the value of having those you know visible experts, or their personal brand obviously speaks to something that's beneficial to the company. How should companies look at their employees and what can they do to encourage that? You know, while being mindful of the company and their goals and and doing it all in a positive light.

Amber Hurdle: 40:41

The fear of most employers is that if one of my employees goes rogue, or you know that they go out, they start promoting themselves, you know, and that's not what personal branding is. It's not self promotion, that's not what that is. And so you know they perceive it as that, that, oh, they're going to go out there and make a name for themselves on my back so that they could go get a better job, and it's like, well, that's short sided thinking, like that's the only option here, that's the only. Like they couldn't possibly be growing their brand, their personal brand, to make their job with you easier. It could be that they just want to be a thought leader in the industry and they love being anchored by your company and they're proud to work for you, but they would like to have a voice in the industry, like. There's just so many different reasons to have a strong personal brand, but the most important one for any employer is if somebody is understanding their value. All that's doing is making them a better leader internally, a better colleague internally, because they understand where they can get plugged in and how to get other people to buy into them and to buy into their ideas, and so they become more influential, which makes business and work and life more cohesive, it's more fluid, it's easier, it's not like there's no silos left anymore, because I mean, listen at any job I've ever had, I've never and I'm not patting myself on the back, I'm just saying when you have a strong personal brand, you can pick up the phone of a colleague who has 19 other priorities of their day other than what you need them to do and you can be like, hey, I'm working on this. Can you X, y, z, I need this from your department, your budget, your team. I need to partner with you on this. Can you co-sponsor this? Will you sit in front of the leadership committee with me and help sell this idea? Whatever it is that you're asking of them, they do it for me because they know I'm going to do it for them and they know what my brand is and my brand is consistent, and so you know I'm using myself as an example. But as you're listening to this episode, think about where you are in your business and is that easy for you to do or not? Is it easy for you to call another company I mean, we've all just talked about Lauren Maydwell like, right, your personal brand, no matter who you work for, can pick up the phone and call a Lauren Maydwell, who's super creative and fun, and she can give you ideas without your brand with Lauren, even know who you are. Would you know who Lauren was? Does that not help the company that you work for to be able to tap into another person who's they don't care about your company, but they care about?

Alex: 43:05

you A brand, whether it's a personal brand, a company brand. I mean, what that truly means is there's trust there, right? I mean people, and we know that people do business with people they know like and trust. So that's why branding is so important, whether it is for you personally or for the company that you work for. And you know people ask Annie and I about this all the time on the show. And I don't think that when we started, when we started the show and when we started kind of going down the rabbit hole that we're in now, we didn't plan to do what we did with the show and we didn't know that it was going to open up so many doors. But it did and it was very authentic and it remains authentic. And I think that's where that's a big part of building a personal brand. That building personal brand is not about saying I am this, I am that, and it's about representing who you are in a way that you're going to that people relate with you, but it's not being something that you're not, it's being more of who you already are.

Amber Hurdle: 44:00

And exactly right.

Alex: 44:01

Authenticity is really the key to that, and I think it wasn't authenticity your word of the year this year, annie, or is it last year?

Annie: 44:08

So what's funny is yesterday I saw a post that I can't remember what it was like, webster's, or somebody said the word of the year for this year was authenticity and I was like, well, dang it, that was my word last year, so I'm way ahead of the curve.

Alex: 44:20

Ok, I can remember it was this year, last year, yeah, but what I?

Annie: 44:22

found interesting about it is the person that shared the post was like I think authentic and authenticity is such an overused word, people don't know what that is and I was like, well, this is somebody that's hiding behind something. Like that was my first response. Like if you're going to say that, but yeah, like I mean just just to be your true self and come out of your skin, so to speak, like just to be there and be comfortable in your own place is so, it's so freeing and so liberating and so like, just like you could float out of the room You've seen and valued because you've positioned yourself, you work harder, you put forth more discretionary effort Like this is it's not rocket science and I can give an example, and I know Steve and Adam would have no problem sharing this but like who's the hiring company for the entire industry, right?

Speaker 1: 45:11

Yeah, exactly.

Amber Hurdle: 45:12

So what does better talent do as a best practice? Every single person that they've hired I have done a personal branding coaching session with. I've gone over all of their different assessments and I've helped them craft their brand. And then they brought me in and I worked with the whole team, using how to fascinate, which is a personal branding assessment, and so like if the number one or I mean I know the extent team as well, but they're they're offshore and also an amazing company and I love them to death. And but like if the number one company for hiring talent employees is like we make sure every single person on our team understands their personal brand.

Alex: 45:56

Maybe it's not something that you should ride off, because yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly, they're telling you it's a good idea, right?

Amber Hurdle: 46:04

So you know if you're an employer and you're nervous about like somebody's freezing up their personal brand, just understand that that human being who works for you has all the opportunities and all the trust and all the people coming into their personal brand, which then benefits you as a company. Yeah, and so you have a whole leadership team full of strong personal brands who can influence and lead and engage in your company and then also pull in resources externally because people just like them. What's the problem with that? I?

Alex: 46:34

don't know. Yeah, yeah, no.

Annie: 46:37

I agree completely. Well, Amber, of course we could talk to you for like 10 hours every day, and just so wonderful. So we're excited to see you. But this will air after the women's conference has concluded and everybody's floating out of the room on all of their new power and grace and I just, I'm just so excited. I just like it's. I told Lauren it's like it's just like a big warm hug every time you walk into that.

Amber Hurdle: 47:00

Like it's just it's a homecoming yeah. And can we? Just shout out for Amy Hinoe, who puts on.

Annie: 47:05

I don't know how she does it. Yeah, I'm so looking forward to seeing Amy and her whole team.

Alex: 47:10

I mean those, those ladies are amazing. April. Michelle Rebecca all of them. Yeah, oh, my gosh, there's, there's, there's several, but that whole team is is amazing and we said before we hit play earlier that a week it's Friday, we don't it's Thursday right now. So a week from today, the things will know that we don't know yet. The relationships were about to make, the things were about to discover it's. It's exciting and what a great way to end the year and a great way to end this Thursday with you, amber. So we appreciate you so much for coming on the show and excited for for next week to see you, but in the meantime, for anybody that wants to get in touch with you, what is the best way for them to reach out?

Amber Hurdle: 47:53

I usually say I'm psychotic on LinkedIn, but I've been so quiet because I've been so slammed, but I'm like I'll be back LinkedIn. I promise I'm not authentic, so I'm not just going to, you know, post a bunch of random stuff. It's this you know anyway. So usually I'm on LinkedIn, amber Erickson Hurdle. On LinkedIn you can email me at amber, at amber Hurdle dot com, and that can get you to whatever company I own now and and you know, you could go to amber Hurdle dot com to get all of my social media or employer brand central dot com and and and get a hold of me that way as well. I'm pretty responsive and I try really hard to get to everyone, even if it takes just a hot minute to make it through the box.

Alex: 48:35

Yeah, I admire that about you. You always get back to people very quickly, and that's that's a hard skill when you I know you're pulled in a million different directions, as we all are, but yeah systems and I have a team.

Amber Hurdle: 48:47

Let me know that's excellent. Christina is in care of my inbox so I couldn't do it. Yeah, love it, love it. Thanks, anybody.

Alex: 48:55

If anybody wants to get in touch with Annie and I, you can go to Alex and Annie podcast dot com, and if you've enjoyed the show, we'd love to hear from you. Please leave us a review. Anywhere that you watch or listen to your podcast, you can watch, go on YouTube or over there too. Until next time, thanks everybody, and Amber, thank you so much for joining us today.